Laura Turner in Conversation with Jonathan Gundlach

The Dutch theologian Abraham Kuyper famously said, "There is not a square inch in the whole domain of our human existence over which Christ, who is Sovereign over all, does not cry, Mine!" This Kuyperian worldview holds that the same God who we worship in community is intimately involved in all areas of our own lives, large and small. As we work through what that means, one of the places we turn our attention to is our work.

There are few people with whom we spend as much time as our colleagues. Our desk may see more of us each day than our beds. We may love or hate our jobs, but we know that one of the best ways to thrive as human beings is to do meaningful work that contributes to the flourishing of our city. Meaningful work takes many shapes: Making excellent cups of coffee with kind service; managing money with integrity and compassion; selling software that makes someone else's job easier. The list goes on.

This is part of why we are holding our fourth annual Faith & Work Forum May 31-June 1, up near Point Reyes. We at City Church want to take this conversation seriously. I talked with Jonathan Gundlach, our director of Community Formation, about why this topic is so timely and important for us. For more information and register >

What is the undergirding vision at City Church in talking about integrating Faith and Work?
We want to break down what is sometimes called the sacred/secular divide. People can feel lost when they think their "secular" vocations have no sacred value--they might know there is value there, but they may not have ever experienced a church that comes alongside them in exploring that value in community. The starting point is helping people to get on the same page, to know your daily work really matters to God and the world. God created human beings to be workers and make great things in the world, to take what God has given us in nature and intelligence and all these different resources and make human life flourish. When we ignore work, we ignore a huge part of what God has made us to do.

We also recognize that people spend about 100,000 hours of their lives - or more - at work. And they might spend 1-2,000 hours at church. So that contrast shows us where people really spend their lives and it should impact how we see what happens after Sunday. It's easy for a church to see the important things that happen on Sundays, but there is much, much more going on during the week. We want to come alongside people and encourage them in their calling, wherever that may be, during the workweek.  It would be easy for people to mistakenly believe a church only values what they contribute to service or direct-ministry. Those are important, but we want to develop a broader view of vocation.

Okay, so to that end, what would you say is a better or more full understanding of vocation?
Your vocation would be what you are called to do with your life--your life's work. The Latin root word vocare means calling, so there is a sense that you are called to the work you are doing in the moment.  That includes your job or career, and that might be the most identifiable piece of it. But, in a broad sense, vocation is about your role in the world.

There is always this question that people are grappling with as to how much fulfillment and meaning they can find in their job versus in their whole life. That's one of the things we'll be talking about at this retreat. God is calling you to a life's work, and it certainly involves your career, but it also involves your family and relationships and your decisions. There is a range of meaning people are able to find in their careers, and that's just part of the navigation of work-life. Some people can passionately lock into a line of work which infuses all of their life with energy, and I think whatever work looks like in the new creation, it is going to look a lot like that. But because the marketplace and economic, social and educational systems are so broken, not everyone is able to find as much meaning or inspiration in their 9-5 jobs. It's important to look beyond just your job to the bigger picture of whole-life vocation.

What will this retreat look like for attendees?
We usually begin every gathering with at least a quick overview of the theology of work. Scripture has a great deal to say about the work of human beings in the world and God's design for work. Then, we try to dig more into questions of navigating the complexities of career and work-life now. We'll touch some on how you discern your calling--which could be your actual career, but it could also be about the next steps you or your business ought to take, and how to make these decisions with wisdom. How do I navigate a complex workplace where there is not always a perfect answer to my questions? How are Christians called to work in that environment and make decisions that will best reach the common good, knowing along the way you're going to have to make difficult choices? Is there such a thing as faithful compromise?

We'll talk about how you might experience God and sense God's presence in your workplace each day and how, as a worker, you can tune into the ways in which God is already at work in your various workplaces and industries.

Tell us about Dave Evans, who will be joining us to teach at the retreat.
One of the most exciting things about Dave is his 30-plus years of experience in an amazing sector of the business world. He's been an active speaker and writer for the last 15 years in the faith and work community, which is really the beginning of that conversation in its current iteration in this country. His experience in Silicon Valley with entrepreneurial projects all the way to managing complex situations in large companies (Apple, EA, etc.) gives him great insight into a variety of work situations. He's an engineer and designer by trade, so he brings a design element to everything, which is really unique; he takes a design approach to looking at life and work. He'll be a fantastic person to learn from.

One of the most insidious myths about work is that it's simply something to do or get through before real life, or real ministry, begins. What would you say to that?
That misses so much of what the Bible has to say about work. It devalues the time we spend there and how much value God intends for work to have. God put Adam and Eve in the Garden to work and til it...to tend it, to make it better, more beautiful, help it reach its full God-given potential. As long as we see work as an obstacle to our flourishing, we are missing something.